General Director of Voentorg. The new director of Voentorg will have a hard time

17.12.2012 / 10:55

The corruption scandal surrounding Voentorg OJSC has taken a new turn. On Thursday, the head of the Department of Property Relations of the Ministry of Defense, Dmitry Kurakin, confirmed information about the dismissal of the acting. General Director of Voentorg OJSC Marina Lopatina. Her place was taken by Vladimir Pavlov, who will take up his duties on Monday, December 17. The new director will have to face a real war between suppliers. JSC Voentorg is a monopoly distributor of dry rations and hot meals for soldiers, and also organizes the provision of household services - washing, drying and cleaning of premises. The state-owned company also manages an extensive real estate fund, including in Moscow.

According to Forbes magazine, two companies supply dry rations: Gryazinsky Food Plant OJSC and Agroprom OJSC. In its investigation, the magazine also notes that the prices of the products included in the packed lunches are clearly inadequate. For example, the price of buckwheat is almost three times higher than the retail price.

“Such prices are an inevitable consequence of the fact that in supplying the army there is not only a monopsony - that is, a situation where there is a single buyer on the market, but also a monopoly. In fact, both suppliers are connected to each other through subsidiaries, which excludes any healthy competition,” the deputy director of the Institute of Globalization and social movements economist Vasily Koltashov. This is also confirmed by the fact that the Ministry of Defense used the financiers of the Gryazinsky Food Plant as pricing experts. Such inflated prices led to the fact that already in the spring of 2012 it became clear that by the end of the year, military units would not be able to buy back the supply of rations. In order to somehow resolve the issue of perishable food, officials of the Ministry of Defense gave orders in many units to remove the military from allowances in canteens and replace food with rations, which were no longer issued during exercises, but directly in the barracks.

The situation in the hot food segment is no better. Until 2012, hot food supplies were distributed through competition between 25-30 suppliers, and two of them - RBE Group and Concord - occupied 51 and 42 percent of the market, respectively. In August of this year, most of the small companies stopped paying their bills. In mid-November, the companies Trading House SPP, Standard Service and Central Catering turned to the new Minister of Defense with a request to restore order to the army outsourcing market. The reason for the complaints was that the acting General Director of Voentorg Marina Lopatina decided to terminate contracts with small outsourcers, redistributing their volumes in favor of Concord. They accused Lopatina of lobbying the interests of the company owner.

Another side of the corruption scandal is real estate in Moscow, which was under the economic control of Voentorg State Enterprise No. 257, also part of Oboronservis. The First Anti-Corruption Media has already conducted an investigation into how Voentorg No. 257 sold 13 Moscow real estate properties through shell companies. Then the Moscow city military prosecutor Alexander Kozlov in July 2009, he appealed to the Moscow Arbitration Court with a demand to declare the deal between Voentorg No. 257 and Konar CJSC illegal. He demanded that 13 real estate properties be returned to the Ministry of Defense, stating that all actions with this property were carried out illegally. However, after a letter from Serdyukov, which came into the possession of the First Anti-Corruption Media, the prosecutor reversed the case (see).

With the dismissal of Serdyukov and then Lopatina from their posts, the case of illegal sale of real estate may be resumed. However, another influential official from the ex-minister’s team remains at his post, connected with corruption scandals around Voentorg and Obronoservis in general. We are talking about the Deputy Minister of Defense, Chief of Logistics of the RF Armed Forces, General Dmitry Bulgakov.“His work also satisfies the new Minister of Defense. Therefore, Shoigu is in no hurry to dismiss Bulgakov and some other people from Serdyukov’s team. In particular, the Chief of the General Staff, General Valery Gerasimov", a military expert, director of the Center for Strategic Conjuncture, told the First Anti-Corruption Media Ivan Konovalov.

Concerning Vladimir Pavlov, then experts refrain from making any assessments of the new general director of Voentorg OJSC. One thing is clear - he will have to face many problems. Moreover, we are talking not only about financial and legal issues, but, above all, about ensuring uninterrupted supplies and services for military personnel.

Ivan Shchegolev

Recently, the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation have been paying a lot of attention to the issues of life of military personnel. In this regard, the management of Voentorg OJSC seriously took up the restoration of a high-quality system of trade and consumer services in all military districts.

A pilot project of this modernized system will start in April, the main goal of which is to provide decent living conditions for military personnel serving in remote garrisons.

In an interview with RIA Novosti correspondent Alexei Panshin, he spoke about the organization of the system of trade and consumer services for the military, the advantages and disadvantages of the buffet, prices in soldiers' buffets, as well as the provision of discounts to military personnel on Voentorg products. CEO JSC "Voentorg" Vladimir Pavlov.

— Vladimir Vladimirovich, when do you plan to begin restoring the system of trade and consumer services in military districts?

- In fact, we cannot say that we are restoring the previous system. From my point of view, the system of military trade based on deficit, which was created in the Soviet Union, could not work in modern conditions, and therefore I would not dare to call it perfect. We are most likely not talking about a complete restoration of the old system, but about modernizing and adapting it to modern conditions. Now we will “grope” for what the military personnel really need, and think to what extent we are able to do this.

By the word “groping,” we, of course, do not mean sitting in warm offices thinking about creating a certain concept. In order to enter the process of modernizing the system of trade and consumer services consciously and wisely, we have planned for ourselves, without delay, to organize four pilot projects (in four military districts), and maybe there will be more. We want to make these projects independent of each other so that each district takes into account the specifics that exist, and maybe even create competition between them in order to understand at the end which of these projects is more correct. And then take it as a basis and develop it more seriously.

— How much money is needed to create one pilot project?

— It’s a little premature to talk about funds today, because we have only just come to the end of the selection of the sites on which we will create these projects. We look at where it is most in demand, and also take into account the economic component so that the project is not unprofitable for us or that it has at least zero profitability. Although our main goal is to create decent trading and living conditions for military personnel, that is, making a profit is not a primary goal, especially since the profit we receive is planned to be spent on the further development of these projects.

But I’ll say right away that we will under no circumstances create large projects that will require large investments. Moreover, we will not borrow funds from the state for these purposes. We are talking about using Voentorg's own funds to create these pilot projects.

— Have you already chosen the garrison where you will test your system?

— In the Western Military District, we chose one of the towns in which about 5,000 military personnel and their families live. We won’t say yet what kind of town this is, but geographically it is located in the Moscow region. It is remote from the nearest populated area, and therefore there are real everyday difficulties for military personnel there. This project will start in April. We will open a large cafe-canteen in the town for military personnel, which will operate as a canteen during the day and as a cafe in the evening. We will try to create a small clothing repair shop and organize meals for two schools that are located in the town. At the moment, it is planned to open 4-6 shops, one canteen, about 15 teahouses and several hairdressers in more than 15 military camps.

— Will Voentorg open? outlets outside the territory of military units?

— Today we do not plan to open stores outside the territory of military units. First of all, we must provide military personnel with trade and consumer services at their place of duty, and there are no plans to open stores yet, we are not thinking about it. But if our pilot projects turn out to be unprofitable, then we will have to understand where we can get funds from. In this case, it is quite possible that we will develop a common network.

— What will happen to the teahouses that are currently operating in the units?

— After food was outsourced, its quality increased significantly, and tea shops became less in demand. Today, soldiers go to the buffet for cigarettes, chocolates and drinks. In all the military units we visit, there are no complaints from servicemen about the food. From my point of view, it would be reasonable to organize teahouses on the basis of soldiers' canteens. But here we have problems with legislation, because the canteen is not designed to make a profit, but exclusively for food. We want to try to combine both because we think that's the most sensible approach.

If during the pilot projects this idea proves itself, then we will take the initiative to the Ministry of Defense so that some part of the dining rooms will be allocated for a buffet. It is extremely unprofitable to maintain a separate teahouse where military personnel come for cigarettes, water and baked goods. And when it is not economically viable, quality always suffers. Therefore, if we set up tea rooms on the basis of canteens, then companies involved in feeding military personnel will be able to provide a wider range. So, for example, using the equipment that is in the canteen, it will be possible to make wonderful, always fresh baked goods.

— What prices will be in the soldiers' tea shops? Maybe food products will be sold to conscripted military personnel on preferential terms?

“Unfortunately, today there are often cases when prices on the territory of a closed military unit are much higher than in the nearest store. This is the same as opening a buffet on a submarine without competition and making fabulous prices there - people will still buy it. I repeat once again that Voentorg is not a commercial organization that prioritizes making profits, much less excess profits. We are ready to work even at a loss. But if these teahouses are organized on the basis of canteens, then the overhead costs will be much lower, and this, in turn, will keep prices at a level that will no longer be higher, but lower, than in nearby stores.

By launching these projects, we set the goal that our prices are no higher than in regular stores, and we will strive to ensure that they are completely lower.

— Will new dishes appear in the soldiers’ diet?

— First of all, you should not confuse the “buffet” in the army with the “buffet” on vacation. We will not go to the point of absurdity and say that military service is a resort. The nutritional standard was established and developed by the Central Scientific and Technical Committee of the Food Administration of the Russian Ministry of Defense together with the Main Military Medical Directorate specifically for the loads that military personnel bear. She, of course, forces us somewhat into a framework, but I believe that the framework is correct. Based on these standards, Voentorg OJSC has developed instructions on the procedure for planning military meals with elements of a buffet. If earlier, for example, military service was associated with pearl barley and bigus, now I can say that a soldier’s diet contains neither one nor the other. Today, the diet is much wider, and it is biased towards meat products, and in order to change it, you need to do quite serious work. The buffet gives you the opportunity to choose. I can say that the quality of food in army canteens is in no way inferior to the quality, for example, in canteens for students.

© Photo: provided by the press service of the Central Military District

© Photo: provided by the press service of the Central Military District

— How will compliance with food standards be monitored and what will be included in the kit that the troops will take with them to exercises?

— To be honest, I have never seen a case where someone lacked the portion that was intended for one soldier, because the food is prepared based on the order. This is not a restaurant where food is brought to order, but this is still a distribution line, but the soldiers will undoubtedly receive their portion. And the supplement can only be obtained at the salad bar.

As for the set, it cannot be said that this is a standard set for everyone. Here, each unit commander, depending mainly on climatic conditions, orders certain products that his unit will use in the fields for cooking. Most often, these are canned food and concentrate.

Taking this opportunity, I would like to note that we recently made a revolutionary decision. There are a number of military units that are located in hard-to-reach places, such as, for example, the islands of Iturup and Kunashir, where products were historically delivered as part of the northern delivery. And we decided that we would deliver products to these islands not as part of northern deliveries, but on a regular basis. We believe that with the introduction of this practice, the quality of food for military personnel serving in such remote areas will significantly improve.

— Now soldiers’ allowances come to their bank cards. Will buffets in military units be equipped with terminals for payment by bank card?

— We have an ambitious project to create a Voentorg discount card. A card that will allow military personnel to receive certain preferences in the Voentorg system throughout the country. And when developing such a card system, of course, you need to think about terminals in which you can pay for purchases using a bank card and, accordingly, “roll” a discount card.

Most likely, this will be a guaranteed discount on the services of Voentorg or those organizations that will fly under our flag. We will issue it only to military personnel, but there will not be a personal card, so any military man will be able to give it (the card) to his wife, for example. Of course, it is much more pleasant to come and pay for the service with a card, so a terminal system should appear. While I cannot say when it will be introduced, we have set ourselves this task and will solve it.

– Vladimir Vladimirovich, what is your joint stock company like today? What changes most clearly confirm his new condition?

– With the advent of Army General Sergei Shoigu as Minister of Defense, as is known, there has been a colossal modernization of the key components of the formation and functioning of the Armed Forces, including recruitment, professional training of personnel, technical equipment and material support, which, of course, places new, increased demands on throughout the military-social sphere.

“ New story Voentorg began with a travel bag, which is given to every conscript.”

And Voentorg, as its necessary component, figuratively speaking, came to life, synchronized with the Russian army, and began to actively develop in modern formats. Today it again plays a significant role in trade and consumer services for military personnel and members of their families.

JSC Voentorg is the parent company of the holding structure for organizing catering in places of service and residence of military personnel. We are in charge of bathing and laundry facilities, production and supply of clothing, and individual tailoring of military uniforms. Along with this, public catering and commercial and consumer services are provided for military personnel and members of their families. An important role is given to the education of patriotism and popularization of the Armed Forces through the promotion of the corporate identity “Russian Army”.

Voentorg operates from Kaliningrad to the Kuril Islands, including Russian military bases, including the Syrian Khmeimim.

There are our units in all military districts. Previously, these were the main trade departments. Today they have more laconic names: “Voentorg-West”, “Voentorg-South”, “Voentorg-East”, “Voentorg-Center”, “Voentorg-Moscow”. Our system organizes 3,500 jobs, more than 2,500 trade and service facilities. In 2017 alone, 2,600 tons of food were delivered to the regions of the Far North, the volume of laundry services amounted to 32 thousand tons, and the supply of clothing service property amounted to more than 120 million units.

– Apparently, the reason for renaming your units was not only their archaic name. As far as we know, they have undergone structural restructuring and their functionality has changed. What is this connected with?

– Until the beginning of 2013, the companies, unfortunately, were selling the property of the Ministry of Defense and renting out its remains. It is clear that all this economy after perestroika and the collapse of the USSR was far from being in better condition. We are restoring these objects and starting to use them ourselves. Because not everywhere tenants are able to work as required by the Minister of Defense. The rules for providing military personnel with essential goods are very simple: availability, completeness, quality. So that military personnel and members of their families do not overpay. The conditions are quite understandable and understandable, meeting the expectations of any citizen, but in remote garrisons it is not so easy to fulfill them. It is necessary to take into account that Voentorg is not subsidized by the state, but is in absolutely market conditions - self-sufficient. Nevertheless, we strictly comply with the minister’s demands and, frankly speaking, we part with those who do not know how to work or are trying to grab something without regret.

– But how, in this case, is it possible to solve the tasks set by the Minister of Defense, and even at a profit for oneself?

– There are no secrets here. We are proud that in five and a half years we have not failed a single government contract. I don’t know of a case where in some military unit the soldiers were not fed or clothing was not supplied. Let's compare 2012 and 2017. In 2012, Voentorg, I repeat once again, was mainly engaged in leasing out objects and selling property of the Russian Defense Ministry. Believe it or not, there was not a single salesperson in the entire organization (with the exception of Voentorg on Novaya Zemlya), not a single cook, not a single cashier. That is, he essentially lost his main specialization.

Today, JSC Voentorg not only provides full-fledged trade and consumer services to military personnel, but also provides a whole range of services in the interests of the Armed Forces. These include catering, catering, bath and laundry services, organization of custom tailoring, development and production of private label products, tailoring of military uniforms, and a number of others. The supply of clothing items has also been added to our tasks. The simplest example is that office uniforms for military personnel are made here. All footwear for military personnel is 95 percent supplied by us.

“Voentorg is developing vending trade. More than a thousand machines in stores and military units from Vladivostok to Kaliningrad are controlled from a single center.”

On the personal initiative of the Minister of Defense, a military travel bag was developed, which, complete, is given to each conscript, and he goes with it to the military unit. The new history of Voentorg began, figuratively speaking, with this travel bag. It's not so much about a handbag with a complete set of toiletries, but about us creating our own brand. It was in our design bureau, on the instructions of the Minister of Defense, that the “Russian Army” sign was born. It was developed by young talented guys whom we invited to work in 2014. They are also the authors of the tank biathlon logo, Army international games, interiors of Voentorg shops and cafes, souvenirs and other products common today.

Then drinking water with the army logo, lemonade, and other products appeared on sale - from clothes to fountain pens. Quite interesting and fashionable things. They can be seen both among military officers, the leadership of the Ministry of Defense, and among young civilians, which is very pleasant.

As you can see, we are developing our own brands and promoting them in retail chains. By the way, a T-shirt with the Lavrov-Shoigu logo was also born in Voentorg. As well as the brands “Polite People”, “Polite Bears”, “Partisan Village”, and a number of others. I think we will continue such actions. Because, among other things, they attract attention to our sales network. We even developed our first drone model, which broke sales records, which naturally had an economic effect.

They did a lot for Patriot Park, literally putting their soul into it. All public catering and trade are organized by us, and no one could do it better than us. Only in the central dining room (350 seats) we provide high-quality food to up to six thousand people every day during the army forum.

– Just a couple of years ago there was a lot of talk about outsourcing in the army. It was believed that this was the most advanced and progressive form of solving everyday soldier problems. But time has made its own adjustments here too?

– It did, but not into the food system. Our main government contract is for food. A soldier must be fed in any conditions. As they say, war is war, but lunch is on schedule.

As for outsourcing, at one time it was introduced everywhere as a kind of panacea for attracting the army to housekeeping work. It allowed the military personnel to concentrate entirely on issues of combat training, and any discussions on this topic were dismissed out of hand. Today I can say with full responsibility that outsourcing has produced high-quality results in providing food to military personnel. A lot has changed here for the better. The food in the army today is delicious. Most army canteens are no worse than student canteens, if not better. Judge for yourself. By decision of the Minister of Defense, the following decisions were made:

• A buffet has been introduced, which provides the right to choose dishes, which has never happened in the army. Today, a soldier can choose from two first courses, two cold appetizers and a salad bar (at least four components), three meat (fish) dishes, three side dishes, five juices or two or three compotes (fruit drinks);

Help "VPK"

There are more than three thousand canteens in the Russian army, which provide three meals a day. Moreover, not a single serviceman has anything to do with working in them. No one peels potatoes, washes pots, dishes, etc. All this is done by professional cooks, dishwashers, and cleaners.

• Bath issue resolved. Previously, military personnel were taken to the bathhouse once a week. But why in the 21st century does a soldier have the right to wash himself only after seven days? Then the decision was made to install shower cabins in each barracks;
• The dry rations that were fed to conscripts were cancelled. Since the fall of 2016, meals have been organized for them when traveling to a military unit by rail, using the type of dining cars.

– You mentioned clothing items. Why were you charged not only with its implementation, but also with its production?

– Because when we started the program of creating our own trademarks for the Russian Army brand and Voentorg stores, at some point we realized: there was not enough production base. We did some interesting things, our own brands, but we couldn’t implement them right away. Then the Minister of Defense decided to transfer to us supplies of clothing from the Russian Defense Ministry.

We created an experimental production plant “Army of Russia” (EPKAR) and purchased the most modern machines. We sew experimental equipment, uniforms for students of the Ministry of Defense boarding school, and much more. In total there are more than 1500 items.

Launched new program to expand the production base. A decision was made to purchase shares from supplier companies. This is done so that we cease to be intermediaries in the placement of government contracts and can significantly influence production policy, quality, and set our own conditions. A number of enterprises have already been acquired. In addition, we have concluded and are in effect more than 60 license agreements.

– How did the idea to create the Voentorg-Pyaterochka chain of stores come about?

– At the end of 2014, the first Voentorg-Pyaterochka store was opened in Vlasikha (a closed town of the Strategic Missile Forces). Previously, military personnel and members of their families had to travel 15–20 kilometers from the military camp to buy goods. When we opened the store, they thanked us with tears in their eyes. Voentorg was within walking distance, with a wide range of goods, quality, and affordable prices.

Our immediate plans include promoting such stores to the North. And recently we opened a new store in Moscow at the address: Devichego Pole Proezd, building 2, not far from the Combined Arms Academy. I invite you to visit it.

Voentorg is also developing vending trade, for which we have purchased more than a thousand devices. They are present in stores and military units from Vladivostok to Kaliningrad, and are controlled from a single center.

Our social task is to create privileges for military personnel, if you like, social prestige over the civilian population.

In conclusion, I would like to emphasize once again that the entire income from the financial and economic activities of Voentorg JSC is directed exclusively to the development of the material and technical base to provide trade and consumer services to military personnel, members of their families, as well as promoting the Russian Army brand for patriotic purposes. educating the country's younger generation.

One way or another, this contributes to the effective performance by military personnel of their professional tasks to protect political and economic interests Russian Federation, strengthening defense capability, developing human capital, creating an image of military personnel who are an example for young people and the pride of our population.

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A. Ermolin- Good afternoon to everyone who is listening to us, the next episode of the “Military Council” program is on air, hosted by Anatoly Ermolin in the studio. Our guest today is Vladimir Vladimirovich Pavlov, General Director of Voentorg. Vladimir Vladimirovich, good afternoon.

V. Pavlov- Good afternoon Anatoly, good afternoon radio listeners.

A. Ermolin- Well, we have met many times in this studio, but this time we have a special meeting. It’s no secret that you recently held a ceremonial event marking the 100th anniversary of Voentorg.

V. Pavlov- Yes, indeed 100 years of military trade.

A. Ermolin- Well, first of all, accept congratulations both from me personally and from the Echo of Moscow team. Let's start by reminding our listeners that this is where Voentorg came from. Still, 100 years is such a very round number.

V. Pavlov- Well, this is a serious date, and yesterday the Minister of Defense congratulated us, and he absolutely rightly said that, of course, Voentorg existed even more than 100 years. Of course, military trade was presented in one form or another before the revolution, too. But historically it is believed that Voentorg was organized during civil war, there was a special order from the Council of People's Commissars on the creation of such a unit, right? And from that time on, it was called differently, but nevertheless, the word “Voentorg” was most firmly established in the minds of both people and military personnel. And Voentorg, of course, has gone through a truly enormous history over these 100 years. Yesterday we invited many Voentorg veterans to the concert, to the ceremonial part, led by the head of Voentorg from the Soviet era, who turned 91 today. Yesterday the Minister of Defense awarded him the Voentorg Centenary Medal. And the fact that we had veterans at our common holiday testifies that traditions are alive, veterans see how we work today, and for me, I say it’s a great honor that such a great leader, to him today He is 91 years old, thank God, he is in good spirits, healthy, and now, taking this opportunity, I would like to wish him great health so that he and I... We have lived to be 100 years old with Voentorg, and I believe that even before his We should definitely live to be 100 years old.

A. Ermolin- What has changed at Voentorg over the past 100 years? In general, what is Voentorg now as a kind of system? I won’t hide the fact that I also grew up with this name, since I spent my entire childhood in military camps, we also talked about it. What is Voentorg now?

V. Pavlov- Well, Voentorg is modern, it’s a joint-stock company first of all, right? For most of its hundred-year history, Voentorg was a division of the Ministry of Defense, so to speak, a direct division of the Ministry of Defense. People in uniform worked there, as you know, right? Today Voentorg is a joint-stock company, a commercial organization, but with 100% state participation. This is, organizationally speaking. And what has probably changed is that... The army itself has changed, the needs of the army have changed, the requirements for today's service have changed, right? You and I know very well that services until quite recently are what they are today, as they say, how could it be, right? but just recently, military personnel actually peeled potatoes, cooked their own food, and had kitchen duties, right? There were night vigils of military personnel there, and so on. This is a thing of the past, it began to go away already in 2010, but today it is already considered an anachronism. Although 10 years have not yet passed since such decisions were made, today the nutrition of military personnel is everywhere throughout the country, I speak about this all the time with confidence, because I have feedback from the children of my comrades, yes, acquaintances, and so on, what questions regarding the nutrition of military personnel, there are no problems in this matter at all. Because professional chefs have come to outsource, food is provided. And this largely eliminated the problems of hazing in the army. That is, today probably no one remembers hazing in the army anymore. Ugh, ugh, ugh, so as not to jinx it, yes, but this is really such a story. Because no matter how you look at it, a person is designed in this way: there is food, there are living conditions, this is sacred, right? And when there are some moments here that allow you to snatch a better piece for yourself, right? Unfortunately, this led to hazing. You and I understand perfectly well, right? That the one who served in the army for more than a year, he was the first to look into the cauldron. Today…

A. Ermolin- And young people are no longer sent out to military personnel at night to fry potatoes.

V. Pavlov- Of course not, and they don’t drive at night. And he gets exactly the same food as the other one. Because the cook standing at the serving counter treats them no less like children, right? And she naturally gives everyone what they are entitled to. That is, the standard of allowance is communicated to every serviceman. Apart from this, what has changed? This means that we are fulfilling government contracts for feeding the army, for washing clothing for the army, and for providing clothing. That is, we sew uniforms for the army, various specific for special forces, we sew clothes, accessories, and so on, for units. In addition, this means that this is a government contract, individual tailoring is in the same way, up to us. Also trade and consumer services, including in remote garrisons, at military bases (inaudible), when we come to the very teahouses that you and I know very well, right?

A. Ermolin- Chipki.

V. Pavlov- Chipki, yes. We get there, we...

A. Ermolin- Is the name preserved now, chipok?

V. Pavlov- The name has been preserved, moreover, we even have such a project at Voentorg, it’s called “Voentorg”-chip, right? It is modernized, it looks somewhat like a gas station. When can you come to the gas station, right? Drink a cup of coffee, eat some kind of sandwich, and at the same time buy a chocolate bar, mineral water, and something else in the store. These are the formats we are also introducing today. Joint-Stock Company, it naturally makes us think about, among other things, how to earn money so that a serviceman can live better. Therefore, we have many projects, and to be honest, today we literally, I already collected... Taking the opportunity that they came for the holiday, I gathered the leaders of all our Voentorg, Voentorg east, west, south, center. We got together today and were just discussing plans for the next two years. That is, for the next two years, we are setting ourselves quite serious, infrastructural, grandiose tasks. Therefore, the need to both earn money and improve service conditions, they are very parallel. Because we cannot improve the conditions of service without receiving... Without earning money, right? Because we are not affiliated with the state, now the new Voentorg is already in the state treasury, without receiving a penny.

A. Ermolin- You are not dating, but you provide services to the Ministry of Defense, that is, it buys your services from you.

V. Pavlov- No, this is in the case of a government contract, they don’t buy services from us, they give us the task of feeding the army, right? And this is a government contract. There, the price of a government contract and the price of food for each serviceman are strictly determined, right? Depending on the region, depending on the military unit, this is such a complex instrument, and this is, of course, an opportunity to earn money for us as well, right? But first of all, this is naturally a necessity of execution. Well, I’ll give you an example: sometimes, not infrequently, we wash the property of military personnel, especially in remote areas. This is higher than the price of the government contract for the washing itself, right? But we are obliged to do this for work elsewhere. But as for trade and consumer services, this is a service for money, and every serviceman, yes, we have a lot of contract soldiers in the army today, as you know, they have wages. There are employees conscript service, who also receive cash allowances. And so they buy this, so to speak, we are here in purely economic conditions. That is, the state here does not date back to anything.

A. Ermolin- (Inaudible) and the store, these are already so...

V. Pavlov- These are purely commercial projects, yes. You know very well about our Voentorg-Pyaterochka project; today we have already opened quite a lot of such stores, and we are going to continue this in the near future. Today, if we talk about Voentorg-Pyaterochka stores, then 49 such stores have already been opened across the country. We really haven’t gone to the east yet, we haven’t gotten there yet, but in the next 2 years we will greatly develop this direction. That is, this direction arose as a task of the Minister of Defense so that in remote garrisons the cost of production would be at the level of the general region. Because it’s no secret that, of course, when businessmen work in a remote region somewhere, they usually visit stores like those there... I won’t name the brands, but in hypermarkets, right? They receive the goods, add their own markup, and as a result the cost becomes higher. So we came to such garrisons, and we will continue to come, and we were able to provide the same price for goods that is in regular stores, large retailers.

A. Ermolin- How do you determine pricing? Well, it’s clear that the same military personnel, the same ones especially in military service there, as they say, you can’t make a noise here, right? That is, the price cannot be too high. That is, we are still forced to somehow regulate prices in the direction of containing them.

V. Pavlov- If you remember, we once had a program here with you, when they called and said “Narzan” in one of the hospitals is very expensive. Do you remember this story?

A. Ermolin- Yes, I remember, then you immediately began... You began to report on air to all the leaders of Voentorg that everything was fine with them, everything was fine.

V. Pavlov- Exactly, it was like that. So, in principle there is probably a very simple answer here, we are working (inaudible). This is our motto lately, by the way, just before the centenary, “with an army for centuries.” Not for a century, but for centuries, right? That is why we really work...

A. Ermolin- A century has already passed, so...

V. Pavlov- Yes, a century has already passed, so we work for centuries. And working for centuries we understand what we have to offer the best prices than anyone else could offer, right? And working (inaudible), we never make a large markup. As for these Voentorg-Pyaterochka stores, why did we still join this project? Because the prices in the store are exactly the same as in Pyaterochka. That is, pricing is structured exactly like this. Here are the prices at Pyaterochka, they are exactly the same as the prices at Voentorg.

A. Ermolin- That is, an inexpensive supermarket (inaudible).

V. Pavlov- Yes, that is, inexpensive, high-quality today, right? Where there is always fresh produce. As for some... Other stores, we generally strive to ensure that this price is, so to speak, at the Pyaterochka level. That is, we have a guideline, we cannot always fulfill it, of course, due to different specifics, but there are guidelines, and we... I will repeat the most important thing again, we are not chasing excess profits, we are not chasing maximum profits. We have facilities that are objectively unprofitable for us, but they are necessary for the army. And naturally, we will still keep the loyal prices there that are necessary.

A. Ermolin- Was it difficult to build business relationships with (inaudible) commercial structure? In any case, in some ways you still continue to remain sovereign people, right? Because you defend the interests of the armed forces, right? And here are the businessmen, whose main task is... Were there any problems in establishing these relationships?

V. Pavlov- You see, Anatoly, first of all, I’m not a businessman, and the word businessman is not a dirty word for me, right?

A. Ermolin- For me too, by the way.

V. Pavlov- Yes, I think you understand how? There is... This is all psychology, to a fairly large extent. Because there are businessmen who work one day, right? Who want it today and immediately, a lot now. But for me these are just remnants of some I don’t know, period or human character, right? If a person and a businessman works for a long time, then he will always look, including at pricing, and at the quality of service and everything else, right? Because, well, tomorrow they won’t visit him. I understand that in the army you are sometimes forced, there is nowhere else to go, you are beyond competition, right? But this part is already being resolved to a certain extent by administrative issues, right? And secondly, probably, the psychology of the entire company. That is, in our company we clearly understand, as I already said, in the army for centuries, right? With an army for centuries. But we definitely say all the time that our goal is to make military service easier. And naturally, if suddenly somewhere here and there, sometimes you remember, right? If prices begin to rise, and we have signals, then of course we always react to this, both firmly and quickly. But in general, I repeat once again, the general psychology of the company is set up to provide the necessary service for a reasonable price. Considering that you understand, we could... Well, we could, we would like, maybe for free, right? Give everything for the soldier who serves. But there is no such possibility, because there is no (inaudible), and in general there is no need. Because today military personnel receive quite good wages, and all our catering facilities are naturally equipped with means that allow you to pay with credit cards, and so on, and so on, right? That is, convenience is above all.

A. Ermolin- You already mentioned the soldiers’ canteens, I think about the cadet canteens, they belong there too, right? Tell us a little more in detail, how is the nutrition of modern soldiers organized now? So this is what they eat?

V. Pavlov- Well, this is really our holy of holies, so that every soldier in the armed forces has breakfast, lunch and dinner in a timely manner, of high quality and in the right quantity; we call this bringing the standard of allowance to the serviceman. That is, we have a special control department behind this, which... We are working with you now, and there are inspections in about 20 of the soldiers’ canteens, this is just the quality of services throughout our country, right? Every day we check at least 20 objects. Well, at the same time, the total number of facilities is one and a half thousand canteens, more than one and a half thousand canteens in which conscript soldiers are fed, and soldiers placed on the payroll, naturally, contract soldiers. So how does this happen, for the most part, in most canteens, if these are not canteens in a small garrison, in a remote part, in most canteens today it is easiest to imagine a self-service canteen for us, a student canteen. That is, you go along the distribution line, you have a choice, there are always two first courses, three second courses, and a salad bar. That is, this is a modern student canteen, only you don’t pay money for what you get on the tray. We always track, we try to track two things, on the one hand, did the soldiers eat everything, right? Because if they haven’t eaten everything, then the problem is most likely not that they are full, right? But rather as food. Therefore, empty plates are, in general, good evidence. But at the same time, we make sure that if someone still wants to get another supplement there, there is such an opportunity. This complicated story, I’ll tell you honestly, because everything is normalized, right? But sometimes this also happens. But I repeat, the most important thing is that the amount of food is calculated, this does not come from the fact that in each canteen someone decides how to feed the serviceman. There are absolutely clear standards that are met; I have already spoken about inspections; this is what is entrusted, bringing the standard of allowance. That this portion should weigh 170 grams, and not less, right? And this is checked through check scales, and the military personnel themselves can check it.

A. Ermolin- But the actual quality of the menu, the quality of the dishes. I’ll give you an example now, well, when I was a cadet, right? IN winter period, only in winter the happiest day was Thursday. Because they gave me milk-rice soup (how many years have passed, but I still remember everything), and navy-style pasta. That is, it was the most important delicacy. Well, whoever remembers the old is out of sight, right? I won’t remember about the other days, but to put it mildly, no matter how much of a stir the food on those days caused... Right now there is some kind of specialization for days, are there any... This is actually the menu, it’s one, and approved for the whole country? That is, in all the towns there and in all the canteens, everywhere everyone eats what is prescribed? Or are there any variations?

V. Pavlov- Well, first of all, the menu is not tied to days. Fish day like it was on Thursdays, right? He's gone. This means that the menu is not tied to days, it is naturally there... I say this word is balanced, right? Probably, probably after all... That’s because it’s balanced and there are tasks, right? Probably for military personnel, the only problem that sometimes arises is probably dinner, right? Because fish is most often given for dinner. Here is fish, after all, there is a culture of fish-eating in the country, it is also not always present, at a young age they still love meat to a greater extent, right? This is probably the only part, so to speak, that is present maybe... It’s not even problematic, it’s a little embarrassing, right? But this is a developed menu, and indeed, most often, udin goes for fish. Besides this, of course, there is no menu; they sit down all over the country, and so to speak, in all military units without exception, the same menu. This means that in every canteen there is a production manager who, based on today’s supplies, so to speak, and everything else, he creates a menu, but the menu is written down, yes, as I said, all the menus are written out very clearly, rigidly, and... But they have the opportunity there Well, for example, instead of beef stroganoff, let’s make meatballs today, right? Or there are the same pasta in the navy. Well, I think I already said here in the studio that in the army, for example, today there is probably something that many people love, dumplings, right? There are sausages, which young people also love for breakfast. All this is present. We conduct surveys; again, those control departments that check, they almost always conduct surveys. And in general, it’s a rare case that we have less than 75-80% of people there who rate today’s food as good or excellent. Well, I repeat once again, we have it, and in all the canteens it hangs correctly, there is a Voentorg hotline, which they can always call, and in fact, any call to hotline What causes this is that we send our control there, and they really look at any signal that comes to us.

A. Ermolin- Do you develop the menu yourself? Do you have any institutions that deal with this, or is it the Ministry of Defense?

V. Pavlov- No, the menu was originally developed for us by the customer, and he brings his requirements to us, which...

A. Ermolin- What are you getting already...

V. Pavlov- Which we are obliged to fulfill, yes.

A. Ermolin- Well, you already said correctly, a young man, especially in the army, he is always hungry. Now, if you haven’t had enough, here are the additional features you’ve already mentioned. The famous chip shops, soldiers' canteens, what else can he buy for himself there?

V. Pavlov- You even gave me a hint here, Anatoly, right? Because indeed, if the serviceman did not eat enough, we... Based on what is sold in chips, we can clearly say what the serviceman is missing during meals today. He doesn't have enough sweets, and he doesn't have enough baked goods.

A. Ermolin- And chips.

V. Pavlov- No, chips probably to a lesser extent. Here are the best-selling items in chips today...

A. Ermolin- Carbohydrates.

V. Pavlov- These are carbohydrates, yes. These are sweets, I repeat again, these are various buns, and these are carbonated drinks. This is what... Why do they go to the chipok? Moreover, if we started there literally 5 years ago, in our chip we tried to cook some second courses there, or at least instant cooking dishes are there, but today they are practically not in demand. We left a small amount there, in many chip shops you can, let’s say, buy a cutlet with rice, right? But by the fact that the military personnel do not take this, but take what I have already said, this is also one of the points that, in principle, he has no hunger, right? He wants something sweet. This is because, of course, sweets are limited in the diet, it’s clear for what reasons, and carbohydrates are the same, right?

A. Ermolin- Isn’t there a division between chips for soldiers and for contract soldiers? Well, for those who urgently serve, and...

V. Pavlov- No, there is no such thing, and I think there won’t be. Firstly, this is not necessary, and secondly, we don’t even have chips there that are divided into soldiers’ and officers’, that is, everyone can go there and receive that service, so to speak. Another thing is that in a military unit there is naturally discipline, and a soldier cannot go to the chipok at any time, and not spend most of his time there. You and I understand that he is still on duty, right?

A. Ermolin- It's true.

V. Pavlov- And here, taking this opportunity, I’ll tell you about one more direction that is quite interesting, which appeared in Voentorg 2 years ago, and it is actively developing. Today we have more than one and a half thousand vending machines installed there. That is, this is just understanding that the serviceman does not have enough, as I already said, sweets and carbonated drinks, so we are installing vending machines in which he can buy sweets, buy water, buy lemonade. This service, today it even sometimes works more actively than the chip.

A. Ermolin- How do they pay, in cash?

V. Pavlov- They can, yes, well, there’s cash...

A. Ermolin- Or there are credit cards.

V. Pavlov- No, cash. We still have only isolated cases of machines with credit cards, because the technology is a little expensive, but in principle we will get there anyway, so that you can pay with a credit card using the machine.

A. Ermolin- Are the officers’ messes still standing?

V. Pavlov- Officers' canteens as such, only in large military units. But they are more like officer cafes, because here the issue of profitability is very seriously on the surface, and we are just going more, as I said, into a chip shop that allows you to eat something. That is, it is both a store and a cafe. You see, yes, and I repeat once again, this is most similar to this, what happens at a gas station. You can come in, you can have a cup of coffee, you can eat something there, some hot instant food, right? And to create a separate canteen for officers, a separate chipok, well, today, from an economic point of view, this is not always permissible, this can only be done in large military camps.

A. Ermolin- Do you plan to make it so that, in general, both soldiers and contract soldiers... Well, conscripts, contract soldiers and officers generally have one canteen. I just... Well, actually, this is of course very important, right? If an officer eats with soldiers, then this... And at the same time... The quality of food only improves from this. I can refer to my experience, when I was still serving, I visited some of them, including in foreign and American garrisons. That is, I remember there, it amazed me in the 90s, right? There in the morning you go into the officers' mess... Well, the soldiers' mess, the officers' mess there, the sergeants' mess there. And of course it made an impression then, right? What, a soldier comes there, a sergeant comes there with his young wife there, with a child there, and he’ll take baby food to warm up, and dairy products, right? And in general, it didn’t matter who you were by rank: colonel, lieutenant, captain, sergeant.

V. Pavlov- Well, I think you were in Syria, right?

A. Ermolin- I didn’t get there.

V. Pavlov- Didn’t get there?

A. Ermolin- I didn’t get there, yes.

V. Pavlov- Well, that’s just it...

A. Ermolin- I was in Afghanistan, in other hot spots.

V. Pavlov- Yes, at our military base in Syria, that’s exactly what was done, right? As for canteens around the country, there is one subtlety. If an officer is on combat duty, then he is included in the food ration; he comes to the same canteen where the soldiers eat. Otherwise, in everything, because I’ll repeat it again, both contract soldiers and soldiers have free food. Officer, well, it’s kind of an expensive story to also transfer officers, as I understand it, I’m speaking a little for the Ministry of Defense now. Therefore, we do not have such an order from the Ministry of Defense, well, due to the fact that an officer can afford to eat for his own money, so to speak, right? In principle, the idea is probably correct and reasonable, it’s interesting, but this is probably more for the Ministry of Defense, right?

A. Ermolin- I want to remind our listeners that the “Military Council” program is on the air, our guest, our expert today is Vladimir Vladimirovich Pavlov, general director of Voentorg. We are talking about Voentorg, about its centenary, and now we will take a short break.

A. Ermolin- We continue the meeting of the “Military Council”, hosted by Anatoly Ermolin in the studio. Our guest, as usual, is Vladimir Vladimirovich Pavlov, General Director of Voentorg, who recently turned 100 years old.

V. Pavlov- This is about Voentorg, not about me.

A. Ermolin- And I said that about Voentorg, yes. Well, we talked about nutrition in great detail, so there is a proposal to discuss in more detail that exhibition of achievements of the armed forces, in which you always take part, right? This is the Russian Army.

V. Pavlov- Forum.

A. Ermolin- Yes, the forum is annual. Did you treat the forum participants with anything this year?

V. Pavlov- You know…

A. Ermolin- What did you participate in?

V. Pavlov- In general, yes, this is indeed a very grandiose event, which is attended by a large number of people, which takes place in the Patriot Park and in Alabino at the training grounds. It traditionally arouses great interest both among the civilian population and, above all, among specialists, right? I will say that on weekends, about 100 thousand people come to the forum in order to see the new products presented, the weapons presented, and just touch the power of the Russian army, right? We traditionally, and I’ll be honest, I’m very proud of this, we are traditionally the only operator during the forum. We do all the catering there.

A. Ermolin- It’s harder for you than everyone else, you not only show what you can do, you also feed everyone there, right?

V. Pavlov- Well, I wouldn’t say that it’s more difficult than everyone else, everyone has their own burden, yes Anatoly, but for us I’ll repeat it, first of all, responsibility. We provide food for all forum guests. That is, starting from the official delegation, headed by the Minister of Defense who arrives, and ending with the smallest child who comes to our forum. This means that for this purpose we have a very powerful stationary structure deployed there; we are opening many non-stationary food facilities. I will say this, this is the period when vacations are prohibited throughout Voentorg. That is, this is the week when all Voentorg employees, without exception, some of them go directly to the site to work, some remain in the offices, working for their comrades, right? In addition to this, in addition to what we feed there, we always present there, indeed, you are right, our young man is very active, but today he is so confidently walking, I will say, on the planet for sure, this is the brand “Russian Army”. And we really always prepare some new items for the forum, often even doing clothing shows. We always have a modern stand, which attracts the attention of a very large number of visitors, because there are always some activities going on there, we present new products that we have developed. And what happened this year is that we presented new snacks at the forum, which today are already quite actively sold in our vending machines, right? These are various bars that are specially designed for us, for the Russian Army, with the brand “Russian Army”. We presented a magnificent collection, because it was incredibly popular with children's clothing, and so on, there was a very interesting tracksuit presented there. Therefore, traditionally, during the forum, we actually demonstrate what we have done and actively sell it. That is, there is probably not a single person who came to the forum without buying some kind of souvenir in the Russian Army stores.

A. Ermolin- By the way, I also buy something regularly. But tell me, does this brand “Russian Army” belong to Voentorg?

V. Pavlov- No, that means this brand was developed on the initiative of the Minister of Defense, including our design bureau “Russian Army”, which is a division of Voentorg, participated in the development of this brand. The brand belongs to the Ministry of Defense. The Ministry of Defense has already transferred this brand to Voentorg for brand management and brand development.

A. Ermolin- For controllability.

V. Pavlov- Yes, for the development of the brand, for promoting the brand, for creating just these “Russian Army” stores. And I’ll say, that’s only for 4 last year, today we have concluded more than 50 licensing agreements with various product manufacturers. And you know how, it started out a little surprising. Well, it’s not surprising, you know how, the business was wary of our proposal at that moment, that let’s put the “Russian Army” sign on ourselves, and your sales will increase. With disbelief. But there were people who believed in it, and they were the locomotives, right? Today we already have, as I said there, more than 50 licensing agreements. These are the companies that team up with us, putting the “Russian Army” brand, when creating their products. We create a lot of toys with the “Russian Army” brand; of course, we have three companies there that produce canned food with the “Russian Army”. And they are all talking about this collection, as I told you, of children’s clothing, which we have also developed jointly, and everyone today is talking about very objective figures, otherwise it would not be profitable for them, it would not be interesting, they pay (inaudible), which comes from the Ministry of Defense, Yes? And they all say that if the product is the same, but next to it there is a product “Russian Army”, and exactly the same product, but without the “Russian Army”, then sales of goods with the “Russian Army” are 30 percent higher, than ordinary goods. Well, for us today this is evidence that the “Russian Army” is prestigious, it objectively causes pride in our country, and people secretly buy such goods, right? And the sign “Russian Army” is probably already familiar to me today, it seems to everyone. I think that its popularity there is comparable to some world-class brands.

A. Ermolin- And if we talk about the assortment, what are the products under the Russian Army brand that are the most profitable, in business terms?

V. Pavlov- You know, firstly, you can, of course, come to our store, the store is located here not far from you, right on Novinsky Boulevard, our store is located directly opposite one of the foreign embassies. And you can see everything we sell. This includes clothing, ranging from so to speak (inaudible) to some interesting event T-shirts. This, as I already said, is food, this is water, lemonade. That is, what is most active, most often they buy very actively, we have... You know, we are just... Why did we take this path? Here is the ration that is made for military personnel; generally speaking, it is very interesting to the market. But we could not repeat it, this ration for the market, because this ration is for military personnel, so that there would be no abuse of some kind, we created another ration, which today is sold quite actively. Among other things, we have a ration called “Polite Bears”, this is also our brand, a children’s brand, and clothes are released under this brand. This is one of the peak sales. Our Army of Russia mineral water sells very well; today you can buy it at Pyaterochka, right? In Voentorg stores. We sell children's toys very well, that's all about it. That is, in general, sales are high, of course we always have a rush of sales before February 23rd, this is natural. But today this store, you know, it’s more brutal. While I cannot boast that we are constantly creating beautiful women’s collections, we are just groping for opportunities here, maybe this will happen in the near future, we are now holding a design competition, we are finishing it. And perhaps we will find interesting designers who can help us create good, interesting collections, including women’s. As for men's clothing there, today it is also very popular. And these stores are interesting for another reason: if you want to buy a gift for a man there, you should definitely go to the Russian Army store, because there you can always find something that is interesting to a man. And again, here we don’t have such high prices, again, I’ll remind you that we work (inaudible).

A. Ermolin- Well, you have always treated, and still treat, the so-called creatives very carefully. Here's to the guys who work in your design bureau, that's how you found them, what kind of people they are, right? Well, it seems to me that you have to have a special talent not to just come up with what is fashionable, right? And somehow link this with the image of the armed forces.

V. Pavlov- Well, in general Anatoly, people are generally piece goods. No mass production people, right? Each person is a piece of goods. And it seems to me that a person, especially an employee, should be treated as a piece of goods. I can’t say that I only have designers, creative people. When we create some kind of creative product, it’s not uncommon, it’s a brainstorming session. Sometimes we directly challenge all employees to come up with their own ideas and so on, right? But in general, today is the world of startups.

A. Ermolin- That's for sure.

V. Pavlov- Yes, and if today you don’t go for some newer ideas, new products and so on, then probably tomorrow the company will not survive with the Ministry of Defense for the next hundred years. So, if we talk about talented people, there are many of them at Voentorg. It's not just designers, it's other people too. Well, here (inaudible) I don’t know, of course management and creating a team, this is of course a difficult task, which you probably solve every day, right? And it is necessary to solve it, and there are not so many people anyway, those who are imbued with their idea, and there is the idea that we have today in Voentorg, right? The idea is really that we are shoulder to shoulder with the Ministry of Defense. And you should get into formation at any moment, right? And go perform some task, and still remain creative, right? But I think this is possible because people are interested in what they do. It’s interesting to see, imagine, when you see your product, you see interest in this product on the part of the buyer, and here, just returning to the forum, during the forum all our employees come to the counters. You see, he didn’t just once create this product, or participate in the creation of this product. He sees how this product is bought, he sees how people react to this product, how they praise it, or God forbid, scold it, right? And you can create anything you want in the office, but the important thing is that it is sold, so that it finds its buyer. This Feedback today with a buyer, you said about startups, right? But feedback from the buyer is even more important than launching a startup. You can come up with something, it seems easy and simple. And to understand that this is what you came up with that people need, that they will buy it, that it is in demand, this is the story of feedback from your consumer, it is more complicated than the creation of the startup itself.

A. Ermolin- How do you manage to create such group dynamics? In business, well, in general, they have already said that this business structure is essentially specific, but nevertheless, a commercial structure. It all starts with a mission, with values, well, in the right business. Do you somehow formulate your mission and values?

V. Pavlov- And I think that’s all I talk about when I’m with you today. The main value is to be needed by the Ministry of Defense, to be needed by every serviceman, right? To satisfy exactly the needs that every serviceman has. This is our mission, if there is some other mission, well, listen, we will not achieve anything. But in order to ensure this mission, we must earn money, otherwise, so to speak, we will not be able to go. You see, during this period we renovated, I’ll look here, maybe I even have, how many of our own premises that we had, right? We have modernized and re-equipped the facilities. We have figures in rubles, this is not interesting.

A. Ermolin- Well, by eye.

V. Pavlov- Well, by eye, it’s probably... Well, I’ll repeat it again, we’re in Moscow... Oh, in Moscow, today more than 50 “Army of Russia” stores have been opened across the country, where our brand is sold. This is a young brand, I repeat, we actually just created the “Russian Army” brand 4 years ago. 3 years ago we started trading in stores, right? In 3 years, 50 stores, that’s not enough. There are a lot of tasks, a lot of problems, a lot of need to constantly change something. I’ll be honest, people are involved in this process... Well, starting with the Minister of Defense, that’s for sure. Here are our products today, they are interesting. And I will repeat our feedback once again, not only with ordinary consumers, right? But also with our leaders who see our products, who wear our products, right? It’s no secret to anyone, this is discussed in in social networks, and in the media, what was the president wearing during the hunt, right? Or while on vacation. What is the head of the Ministry of Defense wearing, right? And the fact that I don’t want to name any names now, right? And when I see people wearing clothes of the Russian Army brand, people who can afford to buy absolutely any brands, but I see that he wears the Russian Army brand, I understand that he chose it. And he didn’t choose it so that anyone... Because we have it, you know how? We have these things that you put on, and you immediately declare so loudly that I am Russian, I am a patriot, I am for the army. And there are those who carry a small “Russian Army” sign, right? This is an ordinary thing that you can’t immediately distinguish from another, but people wear it.

A. Ermolin― (Unintelligible) belonging.

V. Pavlov- Yes, but people no longer wear it to show it off to everyone, you know, not for show. But because it is convenient, because it is stylish.

A. Ermolin- Vladimir Vladimirovich, well, I was in this studio, and many people constantly come, including military leaders of the Russian armed forces. And I traditionally ask the question, where do you get people? And they usually say, well, this is a military school, this is a military university. Where do you find people? As I understand it, your farm is very large and there are a lot of people.

V. Pavlov- I would like to joke that all people, in general, are from the maternity hospital.

A. Ermolin- Well yes. Who managed to get there, right?

V. Pavlov- Therefore, Anatoly, when a company is developing dynamically, then in general there are quite a few people who want to come and work in this company. And then probably the task of any manager is to select and save, and perhaps find the correct location of this person, right? You can whine here for a very long time about the fact that there are not enough people, there are no people, and so on.

A. Ermolin- Well, everyone does that, actually.

V. Pavlov- Listen, you know, in the company I am guided by two theses, just two. These are two quotes from Shoigu’s Ministry of Defense. I really like them very much, and our premises where we hold all meetings, selectors, they hang, I once asked Sergei Kuzhugetovich to sign them. That's two simple principles, the first sounds like this: “I know how not to do it without you. Tell me how to do it, or better yet, do it yourself,” this is the first principle. And the second, it’s even simpler: “With or without you, I will do it. But it’s better for you to be with you.”

A. Ermolin- Well, but in terms of profile, in terms of specialization, who do you need most there? Well, Voentorg is engaged in trade, including trade, right? Are these people there who should have some kind of trade education, economic education?

V. Pavlov- Great question. I'll interrupt right away, great question. I, while you are asking the question, I started going through my employees. You know…

A. Ermolin- No one…

V. Pavlov- No, this is unique. The situation at Voentorg today is probably unique. I, well, I never thought about the percentage, but I have a lot of people who have completed the personnel service in the Ministry of Defense. I have quite a few colonels, I have generals, I have people from the special services, I have people from the Ministry of Internal Affairs, we have employees who came from commerce, you know? And no matter how surprising it is, these people interact with each other. They interact with interest, and they often interact and argue, right? Well, it’s not the truth that is born in disputes, for example, I’m in favor of industrial conflicts, to be honest, right? Because…

A. Ermolin- Well, that's normal.

V. Pavlov- Otherwise…

A. Ermolin- If you can resolve it, yes.

V. Pavlov- Otherwise it’s a swamp. Yes, otherwise it’s a complete swamp. So, today Voentorg employs people who have never worked in government companies in their lives and have not been officials. People who, on the contrary, have a school of bureaucracy work. As I already said, people work from law enforcement agencies, they work from the Ministry of Defense. Well, I can’t say that I… I would give preference there to those who work in the free market, or vice versa. For example, I have clothing for the Ministry of Defense, right? Well, so to speak, the entire government contract, and this is a very difficult job. Do you know how? It is necessary to deliver every product to the Ministry of Defense in a timely manner, not to fail this government contract, to find a company that will produce it with high quality and on time, to control their production, to control the quality of these products. It’s headed by a former colonel there and the Ministry of Defense. This is the control department that we talked about, right? In the same way, it is also headed by a colonel of the Ministry of Defense. There is a direction for creating brands, and the creation of products is headed by a person who once worked in the customs service, right? Well, on this one... Not in the customs service, but next to a commercial company that was engaged in customs clearance of goods, right? Therefore, I don't know. It seems to me, you know, the basic education that a person has received is important, it is important. So that it is good.

A. Ermolin- Vladimir Vladimirovich, well, 30 seconds remain, a short question. Well, Voentorg has 100 years ahead, what are your dreams?

V. Pavlov- I’ll spend it on something else. I want to congratulate all Voentorg employees who are working throughout the country today. To all the veterans who created and lived in the military trade, happy centenary of the military trade. We wish everyone good luck, health, that everything will be wonderful in their families, and that working for the future will be even more difficult and interesting.

A. Ermolin- We congratulate you too, but we’ll talk about plans at the next meeting.

V. Pavlov- With pleasure.

A. Ermolin- Thank you.